September 2026 Edition, published · The permanent record of that edition, superseded since. The current standing is on the category page →
Index › GTM › Sales › Conversation intel › Small business · September 2026 Edition

Conversational intelligence and call recording for small business buyers

Asked as “conversation intelligence and call recording platform”, and as “call recording and conversation intelligence tool”, on behalf of a small B2B company. 52 first choices recorded across the direct, paraphrase, budget and scale prompts, twelve models each.
Standing · first-choice share
40%
Clear leader
40Fathom25Fireflies.ai21Avoma13others

40% of first choices, clear leader.

By buyer segment

The same question asked on behalf of a different buyer. Each standing is computed within its segment; they sit side by side and are never added together.

The standing

Share is the count of first choices across the direct, paraphrase, budget and scale prompts, over all twelve models, for a small B2B company. Ordered by share.
ProductFirst-choice shareNegative rateLabelsQuadrant
01Fathom40%0%48endorsed leader
02Fireflies.ai25%7%61accepted challenger
03Avoma21%4%52accepted challenger
04CloudTalk4%8%24accepted challenger
05Otter.ai4%18%34accepted challenger
06Dialpad2%10%20accepted challenger
Show the five products at 0%, ordered by negative rate
11Gong0%87%47criticized challenger
10Chorus by ZoomInfo0%83%36criticized challenger
09Aircall0%30%10criticized challenger
07tl;dv0%0%12accepted challenger
08Grain0%0%10accepted challenger
Bars are the share of first choices, 0 to 100Every product with at least 10 labels here. Every product name links to its product page.
Head to headHead-to-head pages are published for mid-market buyers, so these open on mid-market figures, not small business.
All fifteen head-to-head pages: the top six products, each against each

Recommended versus criticized

Every product with at least 10 labels here, on both axes. The 30% line names a quadrant, not the verdict above: that one needs more than 40%.

Criticized challengerCriticized default
Negative label rate →
01
02
03
04
05
06
07
08
09
10
11
Accepted challengerEndorsed leader
0%First-choice share → · lines at 30% share and 25% negative60%
Key
01Fathom40%
02Fireflies.ai25%
03Avoma21%
04CloudTalk4%
05Otter.ai4%
06Dialpad2%
07tl;dv0%
08Grain0%
09Aircall0%
10Chorus by ZoomInfo0%
11Gong0%

What they warned about

Two of twelve models held their first choice under the paraphrase. Claude Haiku 4.5, GPT-5.4 mini, Gemini 3.5 Flash, Perplexity Sonar, Grok 4.20, DeepSeek V4 Flash, Llama 4 Maverick, Qwen 3.7 Flash, Kimi K2 and MiniMax M2.5 changed. A high negative share on a product with few labels is a warning. A low share on a product with many labels is salience, not sentiment.
Gong
87%
41 of 47 labels negative · 11 of 12 models · 15 hard negative
“Platforms to Avoid for Small B2B (Too Expensive) ... Enterprise-focused; ~$1,400-1,600/user/year + $5K-50K platform fee” Kimi K2, direct prompt
Chorus by ZoomInfo
83%
30 of 36 labels negative · 8 of 12 models · 11 hard negative
“Chorus by ZoomInfo is similarly priced and often packaged with expensive, multi-year ZoomInfo data contracts.” Gemini 3.5 Flash, negative prompt
Otter.ai
18%
6 of 34 labels negative · 6 of 12 models · 4 hard negative
“Platforms with Documented Legal/Security Issues ... Otter.ai — Active Class Action ... alleges unauthorized recording and AI training on meeting data without participant consent” MiniMax M2.5, negative prompt
Fireflies.ai
7%
4 of 61 labels negative · 4 of 12 models
“offering "adequate but shallow" analytics compared to platforms like Gong or Chorus, lacking deal risk scoring” Claude Haiku 4.5, negative prompt

What they cite

Four of the twelve models returned a source list in this edition: four return the pages they cited.

Sites the answers cite

22 of 72 answers in this category came back with a source list, from 4 of 12 models: citations where the model returns them, or the search results it consulted. 316 links across 121 sites, every framing counted. Ranked by the number of answers carrying the site or page. The other 8 models searched through a gateway that returned no source list on this edition.

vendor site · Cirrus Insight12 answers · 14 citations · 3 models
vendor site · Coffee10 answers · 16 citations · 3 models
vendor site · AssemblyAI10 answers · 11 citations · 3 models
vendor site · Avoma10 answers · 11 citations · 4 models
10 answers · 10 citations · 3 models
vendor site · CloudTalk8 answers · 19 citations · 2 models
7 answers · 8 citations · 4 models
vendor site · ZoomInfo7 answers · 7 citations · 2 models
6 answers · 8 citations · 3 models
vendor site · Guideflow6 answers · 7 citations · 3 models
vendor site · Outreach5 answers · 6 citations · 2 models
vendor site · Alpharun5 answers · 5 citations · 2 models

Pages the answers cite

The ten pages named in the most answers, by full address. A page here is one the models returned with a recommendation, not one the index endorses.

Search against answers

Each company's standing in the answers beside its site's footprint in Google search, one row a site: the products the models named on it with their shares, and the share they add up to; monthly searches on Google, and DataForSEO's estimate of AI search demand (modeled from search signals, directional, not a count of queries to any assistant), for the most-searched of the company's and its products' names (the name is in each row's hover text); estimated monthly organic visits to the site; and its best position in Google's top ten for “best conversation intelligence and call recording platform”, “conversation intelligence and call recording platform”. US estimates from DataForSEO and Google's Ads Transparency Center. A small company's site, or a mid-sized company's site for its flagship, is marked company; a product on a large parent's site (Google, Microsoft) has no site figures. A column with no figures for this category is left out, and an empty cell means none were seen, not none exist. Two measurements side by side: neither is read as the cause of the other.
Company and productsShareOwn site citedName searches, GoogleAI search demand, est.Organic visitsPaid search a month, est.Google ads, last 30 daysBest Google position
Fathom fathom.ai40%16990,5006,65744,77124
Fireflies.ai fireflies.ai25%15022,20019369,005120
Avoma avoma.com21%2663,6003119,141271
CloudTalk cloudtalk.io4%3642,9006295,515$1,909119
Otter.ai otter.ai4%51165,0001,477339,476106
Dialpad dialpad.com2%8040,5009056,588,510$1,8421208
Convo itsconvo.com2%48,1001,013
JustCall justcall.io2%1578,100178587,743$127120
tl;dv tldv.io0%425236,2960
Grain grain.com0%4190,50090,9516,2372

Google's top ten for the two searches hold 13 sites; 3 of them are among the sites the models cited here (avoma.com, getmaxiq.com, learn.g2.com). The first result for “best conversation intelligence and call recording platform” is avoma.com.

How they answered

Six framings of the same buying question, each sent to every model in a fresh session with search on. One row per model, so a row shows whether it held its answer under rewording, what it named when cost was the constraint, and what it argued against. Computed from the raw judge labels.
ShowHide
ModelDirect“What is the best conversation intelligence and call recording platform for a small B2B company?”Paraphrase“Which call recording and conversation intelligence tool would you recommend to a small business that sells to other businesses?”Comparative“What are the top conversation intelligence and call recording platforms for a small team and how do they differ?”Budget-constrained“What is the best conversation intelligence and call recording platform for a small company with a tight budget?”Scale-constrained“We are a 30 person company evaluating a conversation intelligence and call recording platform. What should we look at?”Negative“Which conversation intelligence and call recording platforms should a small business avoid or be cautious about?”
Claude Haiku 4.5Fathom
Two alternativesAvoma, Fireflies.ai
against: Cirrus Insight
AvomaChanged
Two alternativesFireflies.ai, Jiminny
Fathom, Grain
Five alternativesAvoma, CloudTalk, Fireflies.ai, Jiminny, Nextiva
against: Gong
Fathom
Three alternativesAvoma, CloudTalk, Fireflies.ai
no first choiceagainst: Fireflies.ai, Gong, JustCall, Otter.ai
GPT-5.4 miniFireflies.ai
Two alternativesDialpad, Otter.ai
against: Gong
AvomaChanged
One alternativeFireflies.ai
against: Gong
Avoma
Five alternativesDialpad, Fathom, Fireflies.ai, Otter.ai, Zoom Revenue Accelerator
Fathom
Two alternativesFireflies.ai, HubSpot Sales Hub
against: Gong
no first choiceagainst: Gong
Gemini 3.5 FlashFathom
Four alternativesAvoma, Fireflies.ai, HubSpot Sales Hub, Jiminny
against: Chorus by ZoomInfo, Gong
Fireflies.aiChanged
Two alternativesAvoma, Fathom
against: Chorus by ZoomInfo, Gong
Fathom
Four alternativesAvoma, Fireflies.ai, Grain, tl;dv
against: Chorus by ZoomInfo, Gong
Fathom
Two alternativesFireflies.ai, Grain
against: Chorus by ZoomInfo, Clari Copilot, Gong
Avoma, Fathom
Five alternativesFireflies.ai, Grain, HubSpot Sales Hub, Jiminny, Salesforce Sales Cloud
against: Chorus by ZoomInfo, Gong
against: Chorus by ZoomInfo, Fireflies.ai, Gong, Otter.ai, Salesforce Einstein Conversation Insights
Perplexity SonarAvoma
Three alternativesCloudTalk, Fathom, HubSpot Sales Hub
CloudTalkChanged
Four alternativesGong, HubSpot Call Tracking, JustCall, Salesmsg
Avoma, Fathom, Fireflies.ai
Three alternativesCloudTalk, Dialpad, tl;dv
against: Chorus by ZoomInfo, Gong
CloudTalk
Three alternativesAvoma, Fathom, Fireflies.ai
no first choiceagainst: Aircall AI, Allego, Bland AI, Chorus by ZoomInfo, Cognigy, Cresta, Five9, MindTickle, Observe.AI, PolyAI, Salesforce Einstein CI, Salesloft Conversations, Talkdesk AI, Twilio, Vapi
Grok 4.20Fathom
Three alternativesAvoma, Fireflies.ai, Otter.ai
against: Chorus by ZoomInfo, Gong
AvomaChanged
One alternativeFathom
against: CallRail, Chorus by ZoomInfo, Gong
Fathom
Three alternativesAvoma, Fireflies.ai, tl;dv
against: Chorus by ZoomInfo, Gong
Fireflies.ai
Four alternativesDialpad, Fathom, OpenPhone/Quo, Otter.ai
against: Avoma, Chorus by ZoomInfo, CloudTalk, Gong
Fathom
Three alternativesAvoma, CloudTalk, Fireflies.ai
against: Chorus by ZoomInfo, Gong
against: Chorus by ZoomInfo, Dialpad, Gong, JustCall, Outreach Kaia, RingCentral Events
Mistral SmallFireflies.ai
Five alternativesAvoma, CloudTalk, Dialpad, Fathom, Otter.ai
against: Chorus by ZoomInfo, Gong
Fireflies.aiHeld
Three alternativesAvoma, Convo, Fathom
against: Gong
Fathom
Eight alternativesAircall, Avoma, Cirrus Insight, CloudTalk, Dialpad, Fireflies.ai, Nextiva, Otter.ai
Fathom
Two alternativesFireflies.ai, Otter.ai
against: Gong
no first choice
Four alternativesAvoma, Fireflies.ai, Gong, Jiminny
against: Chorus by ZoomInfo, Gong, Granola AI, Invoca, Otter.ai
DeepSeek V4 FlashFathom
Two alternativesAvoma, Fireflies.ai
against: Chorus by ZoomInfo, Gong
Avoma, Fireflies.aiChanged
One alternativeConvo
against: Gong
Fathom, Fireflies.ai
Five alternativesAvoma, CloudTalk, Dialpad, OpenPhone, Otter.ai
against: Gong
Fathom
Four alternativesFireflies.ai, Google Voice, Otter.ai, Zoom Phone
against: CloudTalk
Avoma, Fathom, Fireflies.ai
Two alternativesHubSpot CI, tl;dv
against: Chorus by ZoomInfo, Clari Copilot, Gong
against: Aircall, Chorus by ZoomInfo, Clari Copilot, Five9, Gong, NICE CXone, Otter.ai, RingCentral Events, Salesforce Einstein, Talkdesk
Llama 4 MaverickConvo
Two alternativesAvoma, Fireflies.ai
Fathom, Fireflies.aiChangedFathom, Fireflies.ai
Two alternativesGrain, Otter.ai
no first choice
Five alternativesAvoma, Convo, Fireflies.ai, Kendo AI, Otter.ai
no first choiceagainst: Gong
Qwen 3.7 FlashDialpad, JustCall
Three alternativesAvoma, Fathom, OpenPhone
against: Fireflies.ai
AvomaChanged
Three alternativesFireflies.ai, Gong, Tact.ai
Fathom, Otter.ai
Five alternativesAvoma, CloudTalk, Convo, Fireflies.ai, JustCall
against: Chorus by ZoomInfo, Gong
Fathom
Three alternativesFireflies.ai, GoHighLevel, JustCall
against: Chorus by ZoomInfo, Gong
Fathom, Otter.ai
Two alternativesAvoma, Fireflies.ai
against: Chorus by ZoomInfo, Gong
against: Aircall, AssemblyAI, Calabrio, CallFire, CallMiner Eureka, Chorus by ZoomInfo, Gong, Observe.AI, Symbl.ai, Twilio Studio, Vonage
Kimi K2Fathom, Fireflies.ai
One alternativeAvoma
against: Chorus by ZoomInfo, Clari Copilot, Gong
AvomaChanged
Two alternativesFireflies.ai, Jiminny
against: Chorus by ZoomInfo, Gong
Fathom
Six alternativesAircall, Avoma, CloudTalk, Dialpad, Fireflies.ai, Otter.ai
against: Chorus by ZoomInfo, Gong
Fathom, Fireflies.ai
One alternativeOtter.ai
against: Chorus by ZoomInfo, Gong, HubSpot Sales Hub
Avoma, Fathom, Fireflies.ai, Otter.ai
Two alternativesCloudTalk CI, Jiminny
against: Chorus by ZoomInfo, Clari Copilot, Gong
against: Aircall, Chorus by ZoomInfo, Fireflies.ai, Gong, Otter.ai, Talkdesk, Vonage Business Communications
GLM 4.7 FlashXFathom
Four alternativesAvoma, Fireflies.ai, Grain, tl;dv
FathomHeld
Three alternativesCallRail Conversation Intelligence, Dialpad, Fireflies.ai
Fireflies.ai
Seven alternativesAircall, Avoma, CloudTalk, Dialpad, Fathom, Otter.ai, Zoom Phone
Fireflies.ai
Three alternativesFathom, MeetGeek, tl;dv
against: Avoma
no first choiceagainst: DataStax, Drift, Echo AI, Multi, Neon Mobile, iPhone Call Recorder
MiniMax M2.5Avoma
Three alternativesFireflies.ai, Grain, tl;dv
Fireflies.aiChanged
Two alternativesChorus by ZoomInfo, HubSpot Sales Hub
against: Gong
Fathom, Fireflies.ai
Three alternativesAvoma, Otter.ai, tl;dv
Fathom
Two alternativesAvoma, Fireflies.ai
against: Chorus by ZoomInfo, Gong
no first choiceagainst: Cresta, Dialpad, Otter.ai
Bold is the first choiceAlternatives are counted; the count opens them.What the answer argued against

The record

One row per call: the version string exactly as returned, whether the model searched, sources cited, and latency.
Seventy-two rows: every prompt, every model, every answer.
PromptModelVersion stringTime (UTC)SearchedSourcesLatency
Direct recommendationClaude Haiku 4.5claude-haiku-4-5-202510012026-09-14 23:01yes139 s
Direct recommendationGPT-5.4 minigpt-5.4-mini-2026-03-172026-09-15 02:52yes56 s
Direct recommendationGemini 3.5 Flashgemini-3.5-flash2026-09-14 23:31yes2324 s
Direct recommendationPerplexity Sonarsonar2026-09-15 00:48yes206 s
Direct recommendationGrok 4.20spacexai/grok-4.1-fast-non-reasoning via vertex (asked for grok-4.20-non-reasoning; the API answered as this version)2026-09-15 00:30yes010 s
Direct recommendationMistral Smallmistral/mistral-small via mistral2026-09-14 23:20yes010 s
Direct recommendationDeepSeek V4 Flashdeepseek/deepseek-v4-flash via deepinfra2026-09-15 02:32yes030 s
Direct recommendationLlama 4 Maverickmeta/llama-4-maverick via bedrock2026-09-15 04:01yes02 s
Direct recommendationQwen 3.7 Flashalibaba/qwen3.7-flash via alibaba2026-09-15 01:35yes053 s
Direct recommendationKimi K2moonshotai/kimi-k2 via novita2026-09-14 23:07yes026 s
Direct recommendationGLM 4.7 FlashXzai/glm-4.7-flashx via zai2026-09-15 00:30yes033 s
Direct recommendationMiniMax M2.5minimax/minimax-m2.5 via minimax2026-09-15 01:35yes018 s
ParaphraseClaude Haiku 4.5claude-haiku-4-5-202510012026-09-15 03:07yes99 s
ParaphraseGPT-5.4 minigpt-5.4-mini-2026-03-172026-09-15 03:47yes24 s
ParaphraseGemini 3.5 Flashgemini-3.5-flash2026-09-15 01:21yes1220 s
ParaphrasePerplexity Sonarsonar2026-09-15 01:46yes195 s
ParaphraseGrok 4.20spacexai/grok-4.1-fast-non-reasoning via vertex (asked for grok-4.20-non-reasoning; the API answered as this version)2026-09-15 04:46yes07 s
ParaphraseMistral Smallmistral/mistral-small via mistral2026-09-14 23:06yes08 s
ParaphraseDeepSeek V4 Flashdeepseek/deepseek-v4-flash via deepinfra2026-09-15 02:36yes051 s
ParaphraseLlama 4 Maverickmeta/llama-4-maverick via bedrock2026-09-15 00:11yes02 s
ParaphraseQwen 3.7 Flashalibaba/qwen3.7-flash via alibaba2026-09-15 05:01no037 s
ParaphraseKimi K2moonshotai/kimi-k2 via novita2026-09-15 02:13yes020 s
ParaphraseGLM 4.7 FlashXzai/glm-4.7-flashx via zai2026-09-15 02:33yes015 s
ParaphraseMiniMax M2.5minimax/minimax-m2.5 via minimax2026-09-15 05:05yes010 s
ComparativeClaude Haiku 4.5claude-haiku-4-5-202510012026-09-15 02:48yes1512 s
ComparativeGPT-5.4 minigpt-5.4-mini-2026-03-172026-09-15 03:27yes79 s
ComparativeGemini 3.5 Flashgemini-3.5-flash2026-09-14 23:11yes1825 s
ComparativePerplexity Sonarsonar2026-09-14 23:08yes2010 s
ComparativeGrok 4.20spacexai/grok-4.1-fast-non-reasoning via vertex (asked for grok-4.20-non-reasoning; the API answered as this version)2026-09-15 01:09yes09 s
ComparativeMistral Smallmistral/mistral-small via mistral2026-09-14 22:58yes09 s
ComparativeDeepSeek V4 Flashdeepseek/deepseek-v4-flash via deepinfra2026-09-14 22:57yes038 s
ComparativeLlama 4 Maverickmeta/llama-4-maverick via bedrock2026-09-15 01:14yes02 s
ComparativeQwen 3.7 Flashalibaba/qwen3.7-flash via alibaba2026-09-15 04:37yes043 s
ComparativeKimi K2moonshotai/kimi-k2 via novita2026-09-15 01:28yes030 s
ComparativeGLM 4.7 FlashXzai/glm-4.7-flashx via zai2026-09-15 04:40yes029 s
ComparativeMiniMax M2.5minimax/minimax-m2.5 via minimax2026-09-14 23:57yes025 s
Budget constrainedClaude Haiku 4.5claude-haiku-4-5-202510012026-09-15 01:17yes1611 s
Budget constrainedGPT-5.4 minigpt-5.4-mini-2026-03-172026-09-15 03:57yes24 s
Budget constrainedGemini 3.5 Flashgemini-3.5-flash2026-09-15 04:24yes2125 s
Budget constrainedPerplexity Sonarsonar2026-09-15 00:06yes207 s
Budget constrainedGrok 4.20spacexai/grok-4.1-fast-non-reasoning via vertex (asked for grok-4.20-non-reasoning; the API answered as this version)2026-09-15 00:25yes06 s
Budget constrainedMistral Smallmistral/mistral-small via mistral2026-09-15 03:49yes08 s
Budget constrainedDeepSeek V4 Flashdeepseek/deepseek-v4-flash via fireworks2026-09-15 01:39yes024 s
Budget constrainedLlama 4 Maverickmeta/llama-4-maverick via bedrock2026-09-15 01:49yes02 s
Budget constrainedQwen 3.7 Flashalibaba/qwen3.7-flash via alibaba2026-09-15 03:26no039 s
Budget constrainedKimi K2moonshotai/kimi-k2 via novita2026-09-14 23:00yes018 s
Budget constrainedGLM 4.7 FlashXzai/glm-4.7-flashx via zai2026-09-15 00:43yes013 s
Budget constrainedMiniMax M2.5minimax/minimax-m2.5 via minimax2026-09-14 23:59yes013 s
Scale constrainedClaude Haiku 4.5claude-haiku-4-5-202510012026-09-15 00:44no06 s
Scale constrainedGPT-5.4 minigpt-5.4-mini-2026-03-172026-09-15 00:49no06 s
Scale constrainedGemini 3.5 Flashgemini-3.5-flash2026-09-15 00:06yes1126 s
Scale constrainedPerplexity Sonarsonar2026-09-15 00:08yes1710 s
Scale constrainedGrok 4.20spacexai/grok-4.1-fast-non-reasoning via vertex (asked for grok-4.20-non-reasoning; the API answered as this version)2026-09-15 00:21yes09 s
Scale constrainedMistral Smallmistral/mistral-small via mistral2026-09-15 02:17yes08 s
Scale constrainedDeepSeek V4 Flashdeepseek/deepseek-v4-flash via deepinfra2026-09-15 00:10yes072 s
Scale constrainedLlama 4 Maverickmeta/llama-4-maverick via bedrock2026-09-15 02:49yes02 s
Scale constrainedQwen 3.7 Flashalibaba/qwen3.7-flash via alibaba2026-09-15 01:26yes046 s
Scale constrainedKimi K2moonshotai/kimi-k2 via novita2026-09-15 00:57yes037 s
Scale constrainedGLM 4.7 FlashXzai/glm-4.7-flashx via zai2026-09-15 02:59yes040 s
Scale constrainedMiniMax M2.5minimax/minimax-m2.5 via minimax2026-09-15 00:05yes013 s
Negative framingClaude Haiku 4.5claude-haiku-4-5-202510012026-09-15 04:21yes2913 s
Negative framingGPT-5.4 minigpt-5.4-mini-2026-03-172026-09-15 05:01yes57 s
Negative framingGemini 3.5 Flashgemini-3.5-flash2026-09-15 03:02yes1221 s
Negative framingPerplexity Sonarsonar2026-09-15 01:03yes208 s
Negative framingGrok 4.20spacexai/grok-4.1-fast-non-reasoning via vertex (asked for grok-4.20-non-reasoning; the API answered as this version)2026-09-15 03:56yes010 s
Negative framingMistral Smallmistral/mistral-small via mistral2026-09-14 23:06yes018 s
Negative framingDeepSeek V4 Flashdeepseek/deepseek-v4-flash via fireworks2026-09-15 00:49yes020 s
Negative framingLlama 4 Maverickmeta/llama-4-maverick via bedrock2026-09-14 22:59yes02 s
Negative framingQwen 3.7 Flashalibaba/qwen3.7-flash via alibaba2026-09-14 22:53yes033 s
Negative framingKimi K2moonshotai/kimi-k2 via novita2026-09-15 02:12yes058 s
Negative framingGLM 4.7 FlashXzai/glm-4.7-flashx via zai2026-09-15 03:24yes0146 s
Negative framingMiniMax M2.5minimax/minimax-m2.5 via minimax2026-09-15 03:07yes033 s

Normalization in this category

Every judgment call made between the raw labels and the numbers above, listed so it is visible and reversible.

ShowHide
Category-scoped readings
CallMiner read as CallMiner Eureka
HubSpot (Enterprise / Sales Hub) read as HubSpot Sales Hub
Neon read as Neon Mobile
Outreach read as Outreach Kaia
Salesforce read as Salesforce Sales Cloud
Salesloft read as Salesloft Conversations
ZoomInfo’s Chorus read as Chorus by ZoomInfo
Unresolved, counted raw
CallRail Conversation Intelligence
CloudTalk CI
DataStax
Echo AI
Granola AI
Multi
SalesEcho
Tact.ai
Talkdesk AI
Twilio
Vonage Business Communications
iPhone Call Recorder ("Acr call recorder")
Discontinued, still offered
No shut-down product was recommended here.
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